Topic started by mannAru (@ 220.127.116.11) on Wed May 27 23:42:35 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.
Many actors used the TFM media to shape their image. Songs like "enakku katchiyum venA; oru kodiyum venA" for Rajini. Sila pAdalgalil nalla karuthukkalum solla pattullana. e.g. "yEr thooki thOzhil vaithu; illAmai veettil vaithu" for MGR.
Another example for this type of songs, "pAttAlE buthi sonnAr" for IR. We can list songs for each
- From: mannAru (@ ns.arraycomm.com)
on: Mon Jun 1 23:19:43 EDT 1998
Ennaba! orutharayum kanOm. Sari nAnAvadhu post
"Raja Rajadhi rajan intha raja"
nEtRu illai nAlai illai , eppavumE raja
kottayilE kodiyum illai, appavum raja"
"oru koppaiyilE en kudiyiruppu"
- From: Udhaya (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Tue Jun 2 14:36:22 EDT 1998
I have one from the recent past,
"Intha kaalath ilaingargal kaadhalikka
Ilayaraaja enthan paattirukku"
Mannaru, almost all MGR starrers in the late 60s through 70s promoted his personal, political beliefs through songs. All of CN Annadhurai's movies and songs promoted his socio-political beliefs.
Most of Pattukkottai Kalyanasundharam's lyrics promoted socialism. Early VM songs promoted labor rights and communism in songs like
"Manithaa Manithaa Ini Un Vizhigal"
and the song from Sigappu Malli, which had lines like,
"Singa koottam nimirnthaal
thunbach chirayin kathavu therikkum
naam kanneer virkum jaathi
ini azuthaal varaathu neethi"
- From: damAram (@ bones.deneb.com)
on: Fri Jun 5 01:20:47 EDT 1998
"mannar mannA" mannAru:
My favorite MGR varigaL about his belief:
From en annan - nenjam uNdu nErmai uNdu Odu rAjA
"annAnthu pArkinRa mALigai katti
athan aruginil Olai kudisai katti
ponnAna ulageNdru peyarum ittAl
intha boomi sirikkum antha sAmi sirikkum"
VM wrote about his feelings for old songs...
pAzum pazamum pazaiya pAdal
sometimes VM goes deeper into himself
and write about his love for HIMSELF...
avvaiku koon azagu
(Madurai thriumalai nAikar) mahalukku thoon azagu
kavithaikku nAn azagu
pErazagA iruntha kavithaigaL ivar vandhadhum
Promotion dosn't stop with actors/lyrikists,
even actresses promoted their personal beliefs.
Remember the "Sooriyagandhi" song,
by Jay (along with SPB) expressing her association with
"udan piravA sagothari" sasikala...
nAn endrAl athu "AVALUM" nAnum
"AVAL" endrAl athu nAnum "AVALUM"
nAn sonnAl athuthAn "AVAL" vedham
"AVAL" sonnAl athuthAn en eNNam
Deva's personal belief reflected in Bhasa's
(kidachathai kappunu pidichu amukkirunu - artham)
- From: mannAru (@ ns.arraycomm.com)
on: Mon Jun 8 22:34:10 EDT 1998
Pulavar perumAnE! SenbagapAndiyanin sandhEgam
theera nalla kavidhaigal puNaindheer! vAzhga
neevir pulamai. vazharga umadhu thondu!
"Gummukku inna gumukku thAn"...
1) "irandu manan vEndum. iRaivanidan kEttEn
ninaithau vAzha onRu maRandhu vAzha onRu"
2) "ponnai virumbum BhoomiyilE, ennai virumbum Or
Neengal "ajakkai" expalin panradhu, Cho-vin
"koovam nadhi karayinelE"-il "damukkadippom
AyAlO" anbadhai Chief secretary explain pannuvadhu
pOl ulladhu! VayiRu kulunga sirikka vEndiyadhu
than bAkki. idO ArambikkiRen. ... :)
- From: RajaG (@ kcecfp01.sprint.com)
on: Wed Apr 14 16:29:58 EDT 1999
This topic revived in light of two Rajani prachaaram songs in Padayapaa and at least one each in Muththu, Baatcha, AruNaachalam. This always brings down the reality (with a thud) that Indian movies (be it Bollywood or Kollywood)are mostly commercial and sometimes political endeavors and 'promoting art and culture' is only an afterthought or an involuntary by-product. It is only the discerning few (like us DFers) who analyze and discuss the art content in music, lyrics, theme, etc when clearly, the movies and everything associated with it, has been made for the thara mahaa janangaL. Anyway, lyrics for actors (MGR and Rajni being prime examples) seems to be a TFM trait. I have not noticed too much of this in other languages. Can somebody throw more light on this topic.
P.S. Not that I ever thought that Rajni is India's answer to Anthony Hopkins, but after a few of these 'formula self deityfying' movies of Rajni, I have no respect for his artistic talents whatsoever.
- From: chandy (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Wed Apr 14 17:43:27 EDT 1999
Theres no denying the fact that TF has a very strong association with politics, and has been used as a medium for political propaganda. What started as a vehicle for propagating various dravidian and other ideologies in days of periyaar and anna, changed into political messaging in days of MGR.
But, a number of MGR songs carried definite messages for masses (thoongadhe thambi thoogathe, thirudathe etc..).... this slowly moved towards personality-based songs (naan aanai-ittaal), and then to the self-glorification kind of songs. Rajni songs being quoted here are a natural extension of this trend.
TFM is being used for political messaging and "self-deityfying". The self-deityfying could be attributed to a number of reasons :
1. There is a definite set of people who would love to hear such stuff about their role-models / leaders
2. self-promotion by the artist himself. He/she could insist on such glorification. (IMO, even non-opposition to such glorification amounts to consent! mounam sammadam!)
3. commercial motives by producer, director or others to exploit the popularity of artist concerned.
Can someone throw more light/information on specific instances of TFM in above 3 categories ?
On the positive side, one can feel elated about the power of TFM in creating leaders, gathering mass-support and in being a great medium for political propoganda! But, on the negative side one feels unhappy about TFM moving away from being a medium of artistic expressions!! I, like rajaG, belong to the latter side!
- From: Mannarin Theevira Rasigan (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Wed Apr 14 18:30:50 EDT 1999
Ada ivanga yaruppa nadula poondhu kadhai udranga?
Namma Mannaru evlavu seriousa oru thread aramchi
vechikichu! Pattu vidungappana adha vuttuttu Kadha
- From: Venky (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Thu Apr 15 18:46:26 EDT 1999
Many of Kamalhaasan's songs have self peethification in them. To top them all
"iLamai idhO idhO...
kambeduthum aaduvEn, kaththi sandai pOduvEn
kuthuvadhil sooran naan, kusthigaLil veeran naan..."
and so it goes.
In many songs you can also see the following lines
(Singaara vElan, Abu-Sa etc... movies)
"sarakku irukku muRukku irukku
thala kirukku enakku edhukku"
- From: Ravi (@ hope.cs.umass.edu)
on: Thu Apr 15 19:13:02 EDT 1999
RajaG: enna ippa itha 'a "self" promoting thread'-A aakkareengaLA? ;-)
>It is only the discerning few (like us DFers) who analyze and discuss the art content in music, lyrics, theme, etc
- From: rameshb (@ spider-wa024.proxy.aol.com)
on: Thu Apr 15 23:05:35 EDT 1999
I agree with your point on the impact of some political or personal intent on the creativity aspects of music viz a viz tune making. The emphasis is more on the propaganda in those 'philosophical' songs and the quality of tune is often bewitched. But going by the slenderness in number of such songs in TFM after MGR's exit , i think it is not prevalent in the 80's and 90's barring a few Rajni numbers. As for as i am concerned, promoting personal belief is another theme of expression for a musician , be it politically motivated. He still has the opportunity to be creative and the scope is not limited by the quality of lyrics. I can give some examples of tunes by MSV like 'thambi naan padithEn kanjiyilE nERRu'(Ne In Na). The tune is a creative melody and the interludes(flute and violins) are good. This song is full of political attacks on the then governing party ( i was told). 'veettukellAm veLichcham pOda koduththa paNatththilE , thAngaL veLichcham pOttu vaLarnthu vittAr nagara sabaiyilE' and 'yEzhaikellAm veedu endru thittam theettinAr , thAngaL vAzhvatharku oor paNaththil veedu kattinAr' are just overwhelming! I like this song more for its melody than for lyrical content or MGR. Even the songs like 'nALai ulagai aazha vEndum' and 'ondrE kulam endru pAduvOm' are not all that bad in terms of creativity. IMO, the dapanguthu type of tune for a philosophical number was a trend set by Raja with his number 'pothuvAga en manasu thangam' as it was something innovative at that time. I would n't blame Raja for that. But luckily for TFM fans, the trend did not continue in case of Rajni as his movies had very little political intent in the 80's. But in the 90's , his movies seem to make some blatant attempts to build a charismatic image for him. But this cann't be an excuse for any MD including ARR to overlook the melody aspect of creativity. As for as lyrics is concerned, i think VM is delivering stuff for rajni.
i think reason no. 1 is more appropriate. His fans liked 'athaanda ithaanda' stuff more than 'oruvan oruvan muthalALi'.
- From: elango (@ port21.pontiac02.tir.com)
on: Thu Apr 15 23:16:11 EDT 1999
That was a very good observation. I agree with you. But I should point out that even Sivaji did
use the Movie songs for his political probaganda.
In Sivaji's songs Kamaraj was always praised
and sometimes Indira Gandhi also.
In Hitlar Umanath Song "pOda Nee vAznthAl" Sivaji sings that "vadakkil uLLa makkaL mattum Indiara, theRku enna mada paNditharA". Well! that was pened by vAli - but it basically reflected Sivaji's political interest at that time.
MannAr: Thanks for the good topic. I will write about CHO, Muktha Sreenivasan, Jayalalitha and
Ramarajan MP later
- From: rajaG (@ kcecfp02.sprint.com)
on: Fri Apr 16 11:34:20 EDT 1999
'like us DFers' nu solli, yEn perumai, onga perumai, and ellaa DFers perumaiyum vaLarkka oru muyarchchi thaan:-)
I was only focusing on the lyrical content. You are absolutely right that the MDs still have most of their freedom intact for composing the tune.
True that Kamal has a few songs talking about his prowess. But he has also made movies before and after these 'movies with glorifying songs' which do not include any Kamal specific custom made songs. Plus this has not become a 'formula' for him. Using Rajni as an example, if you check the thread 'What about the songs of Padaiyappa' there was a prediction way before the cassettes were released that there will be a couple of 'Rajni pugazh' songs.
I guess there are two ways of looking at this. Songs which pugazhndhufy a character and specifically the actor/actress playing the role. I think many stars, including Kamal, Sivaji, Jayalalitha have had some songs 'custom made' for them. And then there is a second level, where the actors insist on a 'particular standard formula' for character potrayal - a subset of this is a 'given standard song' glorifying the actor/actress. To a large extent MGR and of late Rajni belong in this group.
waiting for your input on other artists.
- From: chandy (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Fri Apr 16 17:03:48 EDT 1999
Venky, IMO, the examples you have quoted for kamal doesnt seem to be too kamal-specific, some other hero could also fit in those songs. But in contrast, if you look at some rajni and MGR numbers, they are too specific to the personalities, and the songs loose their soul without Rajni/MGR.
Rameshb, you have brought out the songs which are more-issue-based rather than personality-based very well. When the song focuses on the ideology or issue (which is supported by the actor), it appeals more to me, than when it is purely personality-based.
RajaG, there are songs which are person-oriented, self-glorification and puzhandhufying.. you mentioned sivaji, JJ. can you give some songs of them? We should also include IR in this list.. there are many songs that are IR-pugazhndufying - a list of such songs are available in IR references himself thread!
My guess is that TR and Bhagyaraj must have also had songs that are self-glorifying, or songs which would promote their ideologies /affiliations! Can someone give info on their songs?
- From: bb (@ compq1.crhc.uiuc.edu)
on: Sun Apr 18 02:57:18 EDT 1999
venky is right about kamal, but the examples are not accurate. kamal's beliefs have come to the forefront in songs like:
"pEigaLai nambaadhE pinjilE vembAdhE" (mahaanadhi)
- From: chandy (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Mon Apr 19 10:23:04 EDT 1999
bb, this news is suprising as well as interesting. What are kamal's beliefs that hes trying to portray in his songs...esp pae(!)igala nabadhe ? I'd appreciate if u cld throw more light on this.
- From: bb (@ franck.crhc.uiuc.edu)
on: Mon Apr 19 22:50:57 EDT 1999
kamal has put his DK views in songs like the one i stated. several scenes in mahanadhi also tout his beliefs.
for bhagyaraj, one song in rudhra where he shows MGR/JJ photos too..
MR radha also put his beliefs in several films like raththak kaNNeer.
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