Topic started by Prabhu (@ 22.214.171.124) on Wed Oct 8 14:46:50 EDT 2003.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.
This isnt meant to be another comparison thread but just an opinion going by the comments in the various threads. Its surprising why KB never gets his due for his innovations and instead becomes targets for several trivial issues. Why are so many lesser directors allowed to get away so easily and their glaring deficiencies neglected?
Manirathinam, for all his asthetic touches to film-making, is many a time found wanting in ideas. Since Nayagan of 1988, there hasnt been much change in his themes. Add a layer of dialogs to some BBC documentary and you get a mani movie!
Mani preys on the helplessness of the viewer to negative social issues like terrorism. Beyond that nothing much!
I wonder how many are familiar with The Wonder Years, a popular serial that ran from 1988-93 in US and 93-98 in India on Star Plus. Just click here for the transcripts of some 100 episodes http://home.t-online.de/home/reynders/wy/wy-trans.htm
Mani's style of dialogs and interactions are very much similar to TWY. Click on any episode to verify. Mani was heavily inspired!!
KB is often blamed for his anti-climactic endings. But then, to expect a "lived-happily-ever-after" ending in his movies is to only insult his intellect. The rest of his mistakes, probably every other director does. When it comes to interactions between the characters of his movies, KB is unmatched. Nobody even comes close.
Interesting situations and interplays, KB is the master of weaving those magical plots.
Though Thalapathi and Mouna Ragam get my vote for alltime greatest film-making, anyday, KB alone satisfies.
- Old responses
- From: C~P (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Sat Oct 11 00:02:42 EDT 2003
*it is very very old*
this can also be read as *i am very very young* ;-)
- From: kindal (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Sat Oct 11 04:27:45 EDT 2003
Sabesan, did you mean some other movie when you credited (or discredited :-)) Anjali to KB?
- From: sabesan (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Sat Oct 11 07:39:13 EDT 2003
tks for pointing that kindal - yes i meant "DUET".... :-)..
C~P - yes, its Neer Kumizhi.....
- From: rajasaranam (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Sat Oct 11 12:55:18 EDT 2003
IMHO barathi raaja was the best in his early years. he was the first person to understand cinema is a audio-visual medium and he worked well on it.
- From: V (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Sun Oct 12 00:30:09 EDT 2003
I guess you like village kind of subjects more.
Subramaniam Siva the director of Thiruda Thirudi is going to direct a film that shows the plight of an average village agricultural farmer and their poverty.
What a touching subject.
I hope he thrashes the political undertones (like cauvery issue dharna etc) to inspire people to truly acknowledge and work to improve the plight of poor villagers.
- From: PGEN (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Sun Oct 12 01:01:48 EDT 2003
KB is an extremely good writer. I think he also got some support from Ananthu. He can dramatize simple scenes very effectively and create a great dramatic value in it. He was very good at characters and characterization and that is THE important aspect of a film. His dialogues were always on target and never jumped out of character but he was weak in narration and picturization. He strong character and subject is good enough to make you watch the his films.
I am not big fan his "Director touch", I believe it distracts the audience from the story and character. But its KB what I can say :)
Ofcourse, he is not making good movies now and it is bad to judge a director when he almost at the end of his career and most artist in the world fade away as time goes by.
Every good Director has a special talent and unique way to look at a subject and dramatize it. They also have their own "pet" subject which they are interested in bringing to the screen. So, it is futile to compare him with other directors who belong to different time period who don't make films in the same genre.
Well, you can't make a person see the world when he has got his head buried in the sand. Most do mistake, new as the best and top sellers for the best ones. So, its not suprising they biased against KB :)
- From: MADDY (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Sun Oct 12 01:11:12 EDT 2003
KB is a spent force in TF just like MR will be after some 2 yrs.......so comparing these 2 is a real waste of time.........
Mni is an excellent manager( no wonder he is a management stud from JBIMS,Mumbai).......he makes more sense than any other directors in India....... he is the best rite now but not for long i guess........
- From: V (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Sun Oct 12 01:18:56 EDT 2003
Waiting for the day when MR will completely throw away songs that require lip sync out of his movies.
Something like vellai pookal, signore running in the background blending with the naration will do him fine in the international stage.
- From: Kupps (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Mon Oct 13 07:47:42 EDT 2003
When it comes to successfully exploring/explored different areas then it is THE SRIDHAR. MR and KB haven't explored much when compared to sridhar, esp. the former.
As far as importance to female characters/roles i feel bhagyaraj is better than KB or MR. His heroines (female characters) reflect the reality than those of KB or MR. Every female (esp. the heroine) of Bhagyaraj is subtly potrayed as clever(in good sense) pudhumai peN. Even in his dumbest of movies like "vaettiya madichchikkattu" nagma had a weight role but she couldn't do justice.
I like KB's comedy movies. But as observed earlier in this thread he seems to be confused and ultimately confusing others in the end of his films. Its nudely evident that for the sake of being different he finishes the film against actual flow of his movie itself, almost showing a sort of perversion.
But yes at any point of time I would say that Sridhar, Mahendran then KB are the best directors that TFM had. I like MR movies but i cannot call him a great director, yet.
- From: Vatsa (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Mon Oct 13 07:53:44 EDT 2003
MR adapts with time so I dont think MR will be extinct in 2 years. If you see every movie of MR you will see he is in pace with time and not like KB (though KB is a very good director by any standards). Moreover, I think MR, Kamal and some sensible tamil directors are still to create a trend where tamil movies will go a step forward in terms of creativity. Currently, it is hindered by directors like Shankar, formula directors and general audience who want to watch crap like dhool, dum and saami.
- From: C~P (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Mon Oct 13 10:54:07 EDT 2003
i kinda agree with u...esplly when u said nagma had a weight role in that film...isnt that obvious looking at Nagma?! ;)
do u call Saamy a crap movie? ... i enjoyed the movie very much ... mayb the other two are, but Saamy, i liked very much ... i dunno wat made u call it crap
- From: leo (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Mon Oct 13 12:38:06 EDT 2003
In most balanchander movie, one may find references made about the heroines of his other movie( Nee yenna Aval Oru Thodarkathai kavithaava? etc.,)and always some of the songs of his other movies goes on radio or showing the posters of his other movies, very repeatitive and stero-typed, lack of innovations(as his movies has influences of bengal and kannada films and stories, aboorva ragangal story is taken from vikramaditan's story, where the vedhalam tells this story to vikramaditan and asks hims to answer correctly the relationship between the characters). My choice of directors are, Sridhar, Beemsingh,Mahendran,Bharathiraja and for now Maniratnam( though most of his movies and incidents in his movies are based on real story and lifts from hollywood films).
- From: Vatsa (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Mon Oct 13 15:01:41 EDT 2003
Saami is old wine in a new bottle. It had a decent screenplay ... but I dont think it deserved that kind of a hit. I would have liked the same kind of response for Anbe Sivam or Kannathil Muthamittal .. atleast 75% of the response given to movies like Dhool, Dum and Saamy. I am wondering whether good directors will lose hope and we will be loaded with crap movies. Look at vikram and his movies. He is capable of something better than this. I see a steady decrease in the number of good movies from 70s.
Its good MR comes up with a movie without songs. The last two movies of his were enjoyable in every sense. The best part is, he is also sticking with the subject instead of going overboard and ape so called "international movies". I strongly feel international movies nowadays means western, its just that most of the world accepts western concepts or westernism everyone enjoy them though there are less good movies. Any movie which is realistic or communicates what it needs to (if it is a fiction), instead of confusing the audience with so-called intelligent stuff or compromise just for commercial purpose will be a good movie by any standards.
- From: MusicIsLife (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Mon Oct 13 17:47:34 EDT 2003
I agree that Saamy was not that gr8 a movie in the story line, but it had a tight screen-play that made it a hit. and secondly Movies are for entertainment and reason for the HIT.
If it is too much handle by general public like anbe-sivam which should have been more responsive from the city area's or the so called educated crowd, i would have been happy
What to say!!
- From: C~P (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Tue Oct 14 04:02:41 EDT 2003
that is the present trend sadly .... only a full fledged entertainer can make money at the box office...
KM, Anbe Sivam etc fared slightly better in the cities...but they dont appeal to the mass....unfortunate it is the regular cinema-goers are such people...those who have some mind always have a VCD at their disposal...that is the reason that these movies don't get even a 75% response
watv it is...i liked every aspect of Saami....i havent seen a similar subject earlier...mayb u can through some light on it....
- From: raj (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Wed Oct 15 00:01:45 EDT 2003
K.B - His strength is his Characterization which other directors lacked.
eg Edhirneechal had a Old man role which will not appear in the film .. These are KB's Touch which is definitely different.
KB doesnt care for the usual Flow or the so called theory of Story ending.
All his films are master pieces
Thanneer Thaneer, Edhir neechal, Agni Sakshi, thamarai Nenjam, Moondru mudichu etc.
U dont see Sreedevi ,sujatha or Rajni or Kamal or Nagesh
Still we remember as MAdhu, Kamala etc which is the impact KB had left.
Maniratnam is good in Presenting the Movie While KB is strong in the Characterisation
- From: rajasaranam (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Thu Oct 16 11:49:38 EDT 2003
its not like i approve only village oriented plots for movies. its the presentation i was talking abt. cinema is a medium which is an extension of drama. presentation in both mediums are defenitely different. but the directors before BR didnt realise this and they jus gave us stage dramas in the medium called cinema. but BR was the first person in tamil cinema to understand that this medium is different frm drama and he presented cinema as cinema shud be. many of the scenes in BR movie will move along with visuals and bgm supporting it - no dialogues.he was the trend setter in this area and all directors followed him after that. years later directors like MR or kamal have made movies which has stunning visual effects with apt bgm supporting it. no more dramatization is present in tamil movies except for movies frm KB [ paarthaale paravasam - jus watch the climax where every character jumps in with pages and pages of dialogues this movie is a drama captured in cinema]
this was the reason i said BR is better than KB. but cinema doesnt stop with BR, the new directors r way ahead of BR creating audio-visually appealling movies.
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