Great Impact of ARR on Indian contemporary Music and IsaiGnani
Topic started by The Fan (@ spider-we053.proxy.aol.com) on Thu Nov 12 02:16:07 EST 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.
By now we must appreciate the positive qualities of ARR's musical genre or style and interpretations. ARR has single handendly made film music and that too, Tamil film music one of the most favorite discussion topics anywhere. He reengineered or turned around the concept of film music in India and made it a pop culture. Though there is something left to be desired in his creativity, he has forever changed the landscape of Indian film music. Taking it to a different platform, he has escaped comparisons and stands at the heap of a new generation of musical presentation and thought. I feel glad that ARR happened at the right time to Indian films. Otherwise look what might have happened to Isaignani, who probably would've lost the inspiration to stay around. ARR's has woken up IR from his classical mode and made IR change mode to a trendy style, eg: KM and MVU, each filmy score of IR getting more experimental and in tune with current taste for music. In other words, I personally thank ARR for being the EYES AND EARS OF IR. New rhythms, extremely different melodic structures. etc.. In addition, ARR is gaining on to be the next icon of music in Indian film music, maybe not in Tamil film music, however. This is what we need. New persectives, a 360 degree difference in styles. In this thread, it will be beneficial to talk about how ARR brought in new things that made us wonder why didn't our other composers attempt this, so easy, so out there, why didn't they. And,difficult innovations that challenged even IR. This will discussion should be purely to discuss the impact of ARR's contributions and his impact on IR's creative styles.
- Old responses
- From: Srinath (@ s04.austin.ibm.com)
on: Mon Mar 8 16:15:40 EST 1999
Please don't get started off on the bass guitar :-) I may not be theoretically as sound as you. But I know my skill and when I say IR is the master of bass, I mean it. "ARR accentuates that which ought not to be accentuated" is what I said in my last post. He uses a synthesized version of the bass and raises the volume to an ear-splitting level. He doesn't even use a structured bass score. It sounds as if he just plays a catchy piece on his keyboard, switches the tone to bass and repeats 8 bars throughout the song. Songs like Humma, Oorvasi and Maya Machindra are testimony to this 'instant bass' technique. See, a song does not become layered just because the MD records instruments in separate tracks. Let me put it this way. If you were to compare the WC notation of an IR number and an ARR number, you would find the difference. A Cello is to be felt, not heard ! Same goes for the double bass and all bass instruments.
I cannot argue with you, as you will keep coming up with explanations as to why IR is the best
Does this mean that you agree that we have sufficient reason to claim IR as the best ? :-)
My first impression of Annakili was, "Why has he used so many instruments ! It almost sounds cacophonic !" He hadn't mastered the art of mixing then. But subsequently, he did and the result was Johnny, Mouna Ragam, Idhaya Koil, Udhaya Geetham, Erettai Vaal Kuruvi (just 2 songs to prove IR's genius), Punnagai Mannan and so many more. 'Layering' does not make sense without orchestration and that is why I quoted "Chandralekha". "Uyirum Neeye" is a lilting number, but I have not had the opportunity to listen to it in depth so I dare not comment.
There isn't enough space here to list the IR numbers which you ought to listen to simply for the bass. But I'll try to list some rght of the top of my head, and promies me that the next time you liten to these, you will concentrate on the bass.
1. Kannan Vandhu Paaduginran - Rettai Vaal Kuruvi
2. Anjali, Anjali - Anjali
3. Ilamayenum Poongatru - Iravil Oru Pagal or whatever
4. Sangeetha Megham - Udhaya Geetham
5. Chinna Chinna Vanna Kuyil - Mouna Raagam
6. Enna Satham Indha Neram - Punnagai Mannan
7. Andha Nilava thaan naan - Mudhal Mariyadhai
8. Pon Maane Theuduthe - Oh Maane Maane
My fingers hurt from typing on this lap-top ! I shall name some more from home if you are interested. My claims to IR's layering being better are no empty boasts. They are indeed better. ARR attracts more listeners towards his psuedo-layering because as I said earlier he accentuates that which ought not to be accentuated. The entire purpose is lost with ARR's style.
Simply for layering, listen to Vegam, Vegam form Anjali. IR uses more 'layers' in this one song than ARR uses in an entire album !
- From: aruLarasan (@ psiphi.umsl.edu)
on: Mon Mar 8 17:27:07 EST 1999
1. kodiyila malliyap pU,
2. kOdai kAla kARRE,
3. kAdhal Oviyam pAdum kAviyam,
4. manRam vandha thenRalukku manjam vara nenajam illayO,
5. ninnuk kOri varNam varNam,
sorry for the digression!
- From: A Proud ARR Fan (@ nat01smurugap.sgum.mci.com)
on: Mon Mar 8 19:29:45 EST 1999
> ARR is No1(maybe not in this forum, but
> elsewhere, he definitely is),
ARR is No.1 (as of now) in Thamizh Nadu. No doubt.
At the same time, he is more popular here in this DF also. But, the only difference is that, in TN, he is praised for his work, while here he gets bashed left, right and centre here. But, whatever people say about him here, he is continuing as the No.1 MD in TFM and is giving good music. That is enough for me.
- From: Velaiyaththavan (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Mon Mar 8 20:10:12 EST 1999
Naanga ellam tamiz nadu illama enna chandra mandalathilirundha vandhirukkom ?
- From: Shankar (@ webgate0.mot.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 02:57:06 EST 1999
Cud "pon vAnam panneer thoovudhu innEram" be included in ur list of songs having good bass scores ??
- From: Srikanth (@ slip-32-101-16-41.il.us.ibm.net)
on: Tue Mar 9 07:57:57 EST 1999
Talking about bass pieces, try to follow the bass pieces in Iravu Nilavu from Anjali.
Infact all the songs in Anjali, AgniNatchatitram etc had wonderfull base parts - fun to play. The reason ARR bases scores are noted because ARR does not use as many instruments as Raja, he depends on too much on the bass note, hearing Arr's songs without Bass will sound empty. He places the bass note in a wide mode, infact most arr bases are inspired from Madona or Phil collins. There is no doubt ARR has used slaping and other new techcs. But Raja's bass are technically perfect.
ARR gives more choices in choosing the bass tone,eg: Fretless bass, bubble bass, slap bass - But often Raja used Electric bass and Keyboard bass.
- From: Anand Mahadevan (@ freedum.proxy.lucent.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 10:54:09 EST 1999
Talking about bass scores,I distinctly liked the the second interlude run of "Thee thithikum thee" from "Thiruda Thiruda".It was a great run with the flute giving a grand stand finish.
A first of its kind in TFM.But I did miss some chords.Guess IR could have written some progressions to it.But ARR compensated that with some pacy run.
Hope srinath can relate to it,since he claims to be a bass guitarist.
- From: Srinath (@ spider-wi032.proxy.aol.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 12:49:54 EST 1999
Claims ? :-) I am a bass guitarist ! Or atleast 'was' until a couple of years back ! And no, I have not listened to the bass in "Thee Thee", but another ARR number supposedly with a good bass score is "Anjali, Anjali", but I have not played it before and when I listened to it a couple of times, I was not very impressed.
This is the first time I am listening to the bass in "Pon Vaanam..." and it is a typical IR bass - great !
- From: SM (@ nat01smurugap.sgum.mci.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 12:55:36 EST 1999
> Naanga ellam tamiz nadu illama enna chandra
> mandalathilirundha vandhirukkom ?
Neenga mattum Thamizh Nadula irundhu varalai. Innum niraya per irukkaanga. Niraya perukku ARR music pidichirukkaradhanaaladhaan avar ippa TNla no.1 MDa irukkaar.
- From: Anand Mahadevan (@ freedum.proxy.lucent.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 15:10:25 EST 1999
Ooops! "claims" was'nt used in a cynical sense but just was trying to get a point across.
Another nice attempt of ARR on the bass front was "Chinna Chinna Aasai" from Roja.It had some decent bass movements.
Have'nt heard "Anjali Anjali" too closely to get hooked on to the bass score.
Having gotten used to IR's amazing flow of bass, one tends to expect a lot from a song and this probably leads us to take pretty harsh stand on other MDs.
Am trying to get away from this syndrome and trying to hear a song for whatever its worth.
- From: Sridhar Seetharaman (@ sagramolapc.cc.bellcore.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 15:17:24 EST 1999
That sounds very positive. Your kaset "Anthapuram" should be on mail by this weekend. Sorry that I was busy with other stuff.
- From: SitaRam (@ portal.ameritech.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 15:29:29 EST 1999
Excellent educative and spirited discussion. Without a strong contention from Geetha, we would not hear so much from Dorai, Srikant and Srinath. Keep it ladies and gentlemen. However, Geetha, let me say something ARR is just lucky that tamil film production is down, he has plenty of time and his competion is not MSV, Sankar Ganesh, V Kumar, KVM, Chandrabose or others. Times have changed, we also have a very new audience and ARR is very lucky, that even IR is past his energies. So, anything about ARR's bass boost or maltova is simply just does not sell to folks like Srinath, Srikanth and me, because we heard the best long ago! Sorry about this frankness. ARR is just lucky and his music needs more content and horlicks to be appreciated in the long run and by us. Please continue anyway.
- From: kiru (@ surf0004.sybase.com)
on: Tue Mar 9 18:06:26 EST 1999
I think Geetha just vented her spleen in that post. ARR has good tunes and good rhythm but IR is in a totally different class. It might be difficult for people to digest this but the fact is - if you seriously analyze music there are more dimensions to it than just a popular melody/beat. Not everybody (even in the west) is listening to Bach/Beethoven/Mozart. Does that make these greats inferior to say, BackStreet Boys ? Nah .. So popular music has its place, ARR might be the king of it now. But when it comes to serious listening and other durable aspects of music, IR will surely reign over ARR.
To me IR epitomises Light Music (in the classical sense). ARR has been influenced too much by the POP movement.
(Vijay, music taste has not deteriorated. Just that the younger generation needs to be catered to. You need music to dance. IRs dappanguthu's, though might be the music of the land, is not what the westernised urban middle class wants to dance to)
I feel that ARRs music is not good enough to picturise within the context of the script. Anybody want to discuss this ??
- From: vijay (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Tue Mar 9 18:37:21 EST 1999
that the younger generation prefers ONLY dance music is what that makes me worried. i do not care whether the music comes from IR or ARR.
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